Hardwood - Suggestions: End of Game Engine

Forum >> Suggestions >> End of Game Engine

Post ID	Date & Time	Game Date

#22331	07/11/2025 7:30:43 pm	Feb 22nd, 2046
lmartins6746 Joined: 02/26/2020 Posts: 266 North Greenville Crusaders IV.3	All of Tufts possessions look bad to me. Up 6 with 57 seconds left and they are pushing the pace and taking shots in 11 seconds or less? That is bad coaching or low IQ players. If they slow it down there they can either force Azusa to foul or draw the clock down under 30 seconds without taking a shot. Arguably would have better to take the shot clock violation on that first possession. If you are looking for an algorithm then a starting point might be if your team did nothing but take shot clock violations the rest of the game (assuming no intentional fouling) and there wouldn't be enough time for the opposing team to score enough points to win then they should probably slow the pace.

#22333	07/12/2025 8:13:23 pm	Feb 24th, 2046
Ndsam05 Joined: 10/23/2024 Posts: 53 Saint John's University Johnnies III.3	So anyways faster intentional fouls am I right?

#22334	07/12/2025 8:27:16 pm	Feb 24th, 2046
Frankebasta Joined: 02/04/2018 Posts: 69 Rice Owls III.3	I have to disagree: the sequence looks very much realistic. We see endings like that in the NBA all the time (not to mention.these are College kis) If defenceman is playing high press, the ball handler will go to the basket. Players will shoot 3s if they are unguarded. It happens all the time. I used to follow the Mavs, and I can tell you that Doncic had a knack in fumbling the lead in the last minute, game after game. That is Doncic, not college kids. It's infuriating, yes Also realistic

#22337	07/13/2025 8:28:50 am	Feb 24th, 2046
Dynamo Joined: 01/07/2020 Posts: 35 Tufts Jumbos IV.1	The main crux of my gripe is having 5 possessions inside of a minute left that took 24 seconds off the clock total. It's not necessarily impossible for this scenario to happen, but to say realistic is a stretch in my opinion. 5 possessions is over 2:30 of time if played out fully, but somehow only 24 seconds were used. It's an egregious display of time management that I suspect is due to my play style. A play style which should be abandoned in scenarios like this. In both plays mentioned Steve, I think the play should not be developed as a fast break but rather the start of a normal possession where my player is walking the ball up the court. In the first example, we are up 3 with 33 seconds left, but proceed to use 4 seconds of clock and miss a shot. If we just run the clock, they have 3 seconds to attempt to tie the game. If they foul to save time, we get foul shots. Granted we could miss the foul shots, which we did at the very end, but the main point is it shouldn't have even got to that point in the first place. I'm trying not to come off as bitter over this particular loss, but rather this being the prime example of end of game trends I've noticed over the course of many seasons playing a fast pace. If there is nothing to be done, so be it. However, I think Imartins suggestion is a good start to dialogue if something were to be done about the end of game situations, specifically for fast pace teams.

#22339	07/13/2025 9:19:18 am	Feb 24th, 2046
gards710 Joined: 05/17/2020 Posts: 488 Dominican Univ. of California Penguins I.1	I totally understand the gripe and I can agree to an extent. But I think there are other sides that should be considered. Shouldn't defenses also change their behaviors to press more in these scenarios, or as Ndsam has argued for, intentionally foul earlier/more effectively? If a team is walking up the ball against a press, that's gonna end poorly for the offense most times. Thus, the offense would speed up (we see this irl often I feel like with the offensive player speeding up to get the ball across half court to alleviate the pressure). EDIT: I see in these specific plays that the ball was pushed in transition, so there likely wasn't a chance for the defense to press. But say the offense does slow it down. Then, in response, more pressure from the defense. Updated Sunday, July 13 2025 @ 9:33:13 am PDT

#22351	07/15/2025 5:16:49 pm	Mar 8th, 2046
admin Joined: 01/24/2017 Posts: 2564 Hardwood Administrator	0:57 - Tufts: Duenas pushes the ball up in transition. Duenas attacks with the ball on the fast break. Duenas bounces the ball out of bounds. - live ball turnover with 1 minute left and up six. Should the not go for the easy, fast break basket? The just turned the ball over. 0:46 - Tufts: Phillips brings up the ball against man-to-man defense. Phillips drives by Melton. Phillips kicks out the ball to Armstrong on the perimeter. Armstrong shoots from the corner. The shot misses. Melton corrals the long rebound. - Three point game (1 possession). Running the offense. Should the take more time and pass up an open shot? Maybe with a bigger lead. Should they not take a 3-ptr? 0:33 - Tufts: Phillips pushes the ball up in transition. Phillips leads the fast break with Duenas and Armstrong. Phillips passes the ball to Armstrong beyond the arc. Coming off the screen, Armstrong shoots from the three point line. The shot misses. Childers grabs the missed shot. - another live ball turnover in a 3-point game. Should they slow it down or take the most advantageous shot? Armstrong again misses. 0:17 - Tufts: Phillips breaks away with the ball. Phillips takes the ball coast-to-coast. Phillips goes up for a layup. It's blocked by Kelly! Melton controls the missed shot. - another live ball turnover -- definitely should go for the easy lay-up, but shot got blocked. 0:09 - Tufts: Phillips brings up the ball while the defense tries to foul. Phillips passes the ball to Duenas on the edge. Foul! Al Kharrat commits the intentional foul on Duenas. In the double bonus, Duenas is shooting two free throws. Duenas missed the first free throw. Duenas missed the second free throw. Magana grabs the missed shot. - regular possession and the defense intentionally fouls. Unfortunately the free throws were missed. I think if Tufts had taken advantage of the live ball turnovers and scored with the advantage on transition, nobody would say anything. However all the missed opportunities really left the door open for Pacific. Steve

#22353	07/16/2025 12:50:55 pm	Mar 9th, 2046
lmartins6746 Joined: 02/26/2020 Posts: 266 North Greenville Crusaders IV.3	The shot clock is 30 seconds right? Ball with 33 seconds left and 3 pt lead? Hold the ball for most of the shot clock unless you get a 'can't miss' attempt IMO. Yea turnovers can happen, players can make bad decisions (didn't see a defender who can block their shot, etc)

#22355	07/16/2025 9:03:36 pm	Mar 9th, 2046
admin Joined: 01/24/2017 Posts: 2564 Hardwood Administrator	The shot clock is 30 seconds right? Ball with 33 seconds left and 3 pt lead? Hold the ball for most of the shot clock unless you get a 'can't miss' attempt IMO. Yea turnovers can happen, players can make bad decisions (didn't see a defender who can block their shot, etc) Sure you normally want to run out the clock. But you know your going to get fouled, so if there is a live-ball turnover it's not such a bad play to go for the layup/transition basket -- you just need to convert. Do you want to blow it on missed free throws or missed layups. Steve

#22356	07/17/2025 8:17:38 pm	Mar 10th, 2046
admin Joined: 01/24/2017 Posts: 2564 Hardwood Administrator	I guess the question, what is the generalized rule for when a team should start holding the ball for longer? Steve

#22481	09/02/2025 10:24:28 am	Feb 9th, 2047
Ndsam05 Joined: 10/23/2024 Posts: 53 Saint John's University Johnnies III.3	https://onlinecollegebasketball.org/game/1112625 Wanted to post this here, got a fast break with 8 seconds left down 3. Passed it for a layup at the rim. Just makes no sense